DRM an why I think it sucks.

ByLunaversity.xyz 💮at 20th of January 2017 23:51:01

Apart from DO constantly getting it's node attacked it was better since people didn't have to link their servers, it was your own private work so barely anyone knew how to crack it, pretty much no one tbh. And then with all DRMs the auto update feature was nice.It was like there wasn't even a DRM in your script unless you visited the core server files, even then what gain do people have in there since almost everything was configurable. Surprised you gave up on an actual project to go to scriptenforcer.

I made MoonDRM because ScriptEnforcer was lacking serious features and was generally hated by the community.

I gave up on MoonDRM because:

1. It was slowly becoming worse and worse, breaking over time
2. The server costs were becoming very expensive as opposed to $10/a month
3. I hated the code - it was inefficient, spaghetti and all over the place
4. I didn't want to make another thing for me to be responsible for
5. I don't like doing support for it
6. People were getting errors I didn't know how to fix regularly because of some unnecessary complexities
7. The actual Lua was quite messy, unorganised and poorly implemented

I moved to ScriptEnforcer because:

1. I liked the idea of banned servers
2. I liked the idea of affiliates
3. It had obfuscation
4. It started to get more features than MoonDRM
5. It was a responsibility off my chest
6. The Lua was nice and simpler

I made BLib (my new DRM) because:

1. Customers (and the community) didn't like ScriptEnforcer and/or Phoenix
2. Some customers didn't understand server linking and there were too many tickets
3. ScriptEnforcer was making frequent errors which broke customers' scripts when they needed them most (these errors were fixed, but the fact that they occurred in the first place was very big considering the amount of customers I have and how big some of their servers are)
4. I liked the idea of using PayPal transactions to activate licenses better
5. I wanted to manage my own DRM because not being able to manage ScriptEnforcer or understand its inner workings was difficult to explain to customers and obviously fix
6. I liked the idea of customers using the console to activate licenses (maybe I'll make a menu in future)
7. ScriptEnforcer just didn't work for some of my customers and when directed to ScriptEnforcer support they were just referred back to me where Phoenix would blame me for most of the issues (although one of them was my fault)
8. Customers want a simple solution, not a complex one

there's a lot more I'd say but I can't really think about that off the top of my head right now, but I think you get the idea

the reason I haven't been posting in here is because I felt that I was too late to the thread and couldn't easily integrate my arguments into the drama festering here. I probably could've killed some sensitive anti-DRM kids but unfortunately not and I apologise for not joining in

I'll give my two cents worth, I've read this entire thread and I can sympathize with both crowds: I genuinely think that developers should be free to use DRM whenever they like, in order to allow them to manage their sales, so long as they make it clear when and how the DRM will affect their customers. I think ScriptEnforcer is a fine service, though I do question the bias that the administrators of SE have shown towards the users they have chosen to ban as of late (it seems a little too coincidental that users are getting banned for "AUP violations" only after they've made a forum post talking about the problems with the very same service).

When my new product launches soon we'll be launching with a custom-developed DRM which has been designed to be as non-intrusive and user-intuitive as possible, down to a licensing system similar to the one Marcuz has made (I really like Marcuz's - only validates on hardware change). Prometheus has seen success because our licensing is unobtrusive after first install and easy to find and create. We also never revoke licenses ourselves (we've had one instance where we had to do so, the user) so we're the closest to an unbiased party I think exists in the DRM world.

By|UDG| The Commanderat 26th of January 2017 22:28:42

Man, that's about 3000+ views worth of new visitors once the script updates and the older versions start breaking.

It takes time but your sales will increase from the advertisement, plus the leaker will be banned before he can do it again so ezpz. Everyones' script gets leaked no matter if it has a DRM or not, and those DRMs get cracked which has happened a lot and where released.

You're missing out on free advertisement.

Lol, your whole point will be invalid when we release our new system that even haters of SE will benefit from.

By|UDG| The Commanderat 26th of January 2017 23:26:53

Lol, your whole point will be invalid when we release our new system that even haters of SE will benefit from.

what's it gonna b commando, u can't keep us in the dark if u wanna defend ur precious ScriptEnforcer. ScriptEnforcer is just overkilling it, and like I said the more you stretch the more chance of cracks getting bigger, DRMs can only be so effective and SE has passed that now it's degrading because people are getting pissed with all the requirements they need to accomplish just to get a fucking Garry's Mod script working.

Honestly, ever noticed how noise was near quite about SE when it didn't have server verification? That's cause customers didn't care as long as it didn't bother them. Now you got this huge commotion about it, and you have no revolt against others (other than Nordahl's ban system, not even a DRM) DRMs. You guys ruined it already, sales are declining and customer happyness is only plundering for ScriptEnforcer scripts.

If you're a good content creator or even leader you'll know it's the happyness that is emitted from your product, that's how things expand and strive, if the people (the customers in this example) are happy, your scripts and small business strive and expand, if they're not happy which is what ScriptEnforcer makes them, your script will plunder and just stay at a depleting rate of efficiency in sales, expansion and general usage. This may just be me, but I only make products I know people will enjoy, I don't make useless shit that'll just get sales and me not care about it, if people are happy with my product I'm happy and motivated, if they're not I'm not motivated to make anything else afterwards related/or at all.

Here is a perfect example of what I'm talking about.

The most important aspect of an external DRM provider is neutrality. You cannot ban people because they are openly making fun of you or your service, you need to know better than that. That's the least thing I would expect when I pay for a service.

"ScriptEnforcer increase sale LOL" People are getting tired. (This is just some of them, there are many other comment, note that I do not approve of all the arguments given in the comments.)

Btw : You didn't even use your own perfect product...

By[MyDarkRP] DiaZzZyat 27th of January 2017 12:53:39

"ScriptEnforcer increase sale LOL"People are getting tired. (This is just some of them, there are many other comment, note that I do not approve of all the arguments given in the comments.)

https://scriptfodder.com/scripts/view/3587/ Am I seeing a little friend train here?

http://steamcommunity.com/id/timrai/ (timrai) - DJReFor/DDG Rexxor(TeenchGod) friends. (That takes out two of the anti-drm commentary) http://steamcommunity.com/id/gwheelz/ - OP friend, disregard.

I know people keep using downtime as an excuse, but ironically we've had less than 1% downtime in two years. Another popular excuse- "lag", lol.

You may say that SE is very anti-consumer and an aggressive DRM, but as i'm sure you are all aware, these things need to be in place because this community has proven in far more cases guilty before innocent. It does it's job, and is proven to be effective, regardless of what nonsense is fed.

It is none of your business to complain about them when it does not affect you. Move on and argue about something else. This goes to everyone being childish in comments. Grow up.

Now, if anyone wants to have a proper discussion, without poking or creating drama (which i know is hard for this community), then feel free to post some constructive criticism on how you think we could improve our service on discord.

ByPhoenixf129at 27th of January 2017 15:22:19

Now, if anyone wants to have a proper discussion, without poking or creating drama

I agreed with you 100% until you said this ^ and then right after that said

ByPhoenixf129at 27th of January 2017 15:22:19

(which i know is hard for this community)

this isn't gonna create drama? or poking.

I'm not saying this to cause anything, and I don't mind you. But I think you've taken this all the wrong way. People are just trying to tell you suggestions here, and if you dont want to take them onboard because they're posting them in a way that hurts your feelings and not in a discord then quite frankly you're ruining your own business, nobody else's.

ByQuackDuckat 27th of January 2017 16:18:37

I agreed with you 100% until you said this ^and then right after that saidthis isn't gonna create drama? or poking.I'm not saying this to cause anything, and I don't mind you. But I think you've taken this all the wrong way.People are just trying to tell you suggestions here, and if you dont want to take them onboard because they're posting them in a way that hurts your feelings and not in a discord then quite frankly you're ruining your own business, nobody else's.

I don't think shitting up someone's comments on their script purchase page is giving suggestions (not you), it's downright fucking rude, this isn't the first time. Nor releasing a "working" bypass, nor would I class most of this thread as any kind of suggestive nature, if anything I would class it as band-wagoning with the same individuals who either;

1. understand little about the service and/or the systems behind it and therefore don't understand-
2. are banned from the service for previous drama-
3. are misled by others to believe SE is evil (lol)-
4. hate the service because I created it-

The only reason why Server Authing is hated is out of sheer laziness. It's a ONE-STEP activation that you never need to do again. This is already being revised to make it easier, however it plays a clear point in dealing with many cases and is classified as proof of ownership. This also (because of the nature of ownership) also proves your innocence (or guilt) if you've used leaks or are leaking scripts. This system will not be going away.

The majority of this threads posts were in my eyes a waste of time, so like i said if you want to have a proper discussion about our DRM, that isn't going to be watered down by repetitive (some even baseless) arguing, or even discuss some of our upcoming features such as timed trial/demoing for potential buyers of your script, you know where I am.

wtf happened to my post

"CSRF Token Mismatch"

I can't be fucked typing it out again.

ByPhoenixf129at 27th of January 2017 15:22:19

https://scriptfodder.com/scripts/view/3587/Am I seeing a little friend train here?http://steamcommunity.com/id/timrai/ (timrai) - DJReFor/DDG Rexxor(TeenchGod) friends. (That takes out two of the anti-drm commentary)http://steamcommunity.com/id/gwheelz/ - OP friend, disregard.

So what? They have mutual friends, I've done jobs for Rexxor and I know DJReFor has most likely done jobs for him too, just cause people are on eachothers' friends list doesn't mean they're an actual customer with an opinion they want to speak.

I know people keep using downtime as an excuse, but ironically we've had less than 1% downtime in two years. Another popular excuse- "lag",lol.

The lag comment is probably false but people pay more attention to the actual customer comments, cause pretty much everyone who replied are customers on scriptfodder, regular ones.

You may say that SE is very anti-consumer and an aggressive DRM, but as i'm sure you are all aware, these things need to be in place because this community has proven in far more cases guilty before innocent. It does it's job, and is proven to be effective, regardless of what nonsense is fed.

I don't know, if drizzy can crack it does it really do it's job? The DRM is anti-customer because of the way it acts, you force people to link themselves to your website completely against their will to make a script work, the DRM is inefficient cause it doesn't work for everyone, you either need to remove the server linking to regain customer satisfaction or get rid of this train wreck, which we all know you won't do.

It is none of your business to complain about them when it does not affect you. Move on and argue about something else. This goes to everyone being childish in comments.Grow up.

Someone spoke up, now everyone feels good enough to speak their mind about the DRM on that script in the comments, you have no control over what people can say unless you want to ban them all for back talking your over-dosed DRM.

Now, if anyone wants to have a proper discussion, without poking or creating drama (which i know is hard for this community), then feel free to post some constructive criticism on how you think we could improve our service ondiscord.

Remove the server linking shit and you'll regain respect for this DRM system. It was efficient enough without it, now you're just punching more holes in the system.

Edited

By|UDG| The Commanderat 27th of January 2017 18:26:34

wtf happened to my post"CSRF Token Mismatch"I can't be fucked typing it out again.

Press the back button, Marcuz said it should cache.

ByPhoenixf129at 27th of January 2017 15:22:19

Am I seeing a little friend train here?http://steamcommunity.com/id/timrai/ (timrai) - DJReFor/DDG Rexxor(TeenchGod) friends. (That takes out two of the anti-drm commentary)http://steamcommunity.com/id/gwheelz/ - OP friend, disregard.

Why a little friend train? Is it wrong if I have people on my friendslist that are associated with ScriptFodder? Doesn't mean I talk daily to them or are friends. Also I didn't aim my opinion at you, it was just generally about what I expect from a DRM as an user.

The problem is right now that there have been really unclear cases about some bans of people which make people doubt about the neutrality of the service.

I hate using ScriptEnforcer on my server. It's just a pain in the ass because of obvious reasons everyone has already mentioned. I run a decent sized DarkRP community and we have trouble with it all the time.

ByLunaversity.xyz 💮at 27th of January 2017 19:00:18

I don't know, if drizzy can crack it does it really do it's job? The DRM is anti-customer because of the way it acts, you force people to link themselves to your website completely against their will to make a script work, the DRM is inefficient cause it doesn't work foreveryone, you either need to remove the server linking to regain customer satisfaction or get rid of this train wreck, which we all know you won't do.

Didn't we already go over this (again baseless) argument previously? TLDR; If you can even call "his" copy/paste a crack, maybe it will work someday too- at least he left credits that he didn't make it.

You know about the DRM prior to purchase, therefore you also know about the requirement of linking your server, this isn't new either, this rule came into play when you were banned from the service last year. [for those who wish to read]

You are not forced to purchase these scripts and not forced to link your server. The SMALL MINORITY of users that do have a problem linking their server are resolved by our support team. I already told you the system is going to be revised, but it is not being removed.

By[IGN] Skeptic ❄at 27th of January 2017 19:04:48

I hate using ScriptEnforcer on my server. It's just a pain in the ass because of obvious reasons everyone has already mentioned. I run a decent sized DarkRP community and we have trouble with it all the time.

Open a ticket if you're still having issues since your last report 10 days ago. Looks fine from our end though.

ByPhoenixf129at 27th of January 2017 19:20:40

Didn't we already go over this (again baseless) argument previously? TLDR; If you can even call "his" copy/paste a crack, maybe it will work someday too- at least he left credits that he didn't make it.

It worked though already, and you guys had to add an extra step to prevent it from working which was what everyone is thinking because you added that new token feature or "Ok" feature. You wouldn't have added it if it didn't work now would ya because that'd just be a waste of an extra step.

You know about the DRM prior to purchase, therefore you also know about the requirement of linking your server, this isn't new either, this rule came into play when you were banned from the service a year ago.[for those who wish to read]

These where personal issues that linked to the DRM, still personal, I tend to burry some things, obviously you wanna go and dig it up, doesn't really bother me if you want to bring past issues back up.

You are not forced to purchase these scripts and not forced to link your server. The SMALL MINORITY of users that do have a problem linking their server are resolved by our support team. I already told you the system is going to be revised, but it is not being removed.

"Small" http://i.lunaversity.xyz/cvuj.png http://i.lunaversity.xyz/aw2b.png http://i.lunaversity.xyz/1kj4.png This is from 2 content creators' scripts, and it's only me searching "Enforcer" I bet if I went through all the tickets I have I'd find hundreds more.

ByLunaversity.xyz 💮at 27th of January 2017 19:30:20

It worked though already, and you guys had to add an extra step to prevent it from working which was what everyone is thinking because you added that new token feature or "Ok" feature. You wouldn't have added it if it didn't work now would ya because that'd just be a waste of an extra step.

Ok, so, When did I add that token feature?

I mean i dont want to get banned for being a meanie or anything, but scriptenforcer will be about as useful as tits on a nun if/when the SE bypass gets publicly released.

ByPhoenixf129at 27th of January 2017 19:35:33

Ok, so, When did I add that token feature?

According to the new tickets after drizzy got banned.

Edited

BySmithyTat 27th of January 2017 19:37:53

I mean i dont want to get banned for being a meanie or anything, but scriptenforcer will be about as useful as tits on a nun if/when the SE bypass gets publicly released.

Hire someone to make one, it's not against the rules if you use it for the scripts you own.